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SiIvaGunner Wiki:Moot/Log 2024 July 06

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TurretBot – Remove or split Template:Events (https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/Template:Events), it is too large to be useful for navigation and there is already a list of channel events (https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_channel_events)
TurretBot – Add dev.fandom navbox to the wiki. All of the current navboxes (https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Navboxes) are converted at [https://test-123.fandom.com/wiki/category:navboxes.] A new version of Template:Navbox series (https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/Template:Navbox_series) should not be created since it would be pointless; conversion of navbox series templates to dev.fandom navbox templates should be done on the main wiki to prevent series links from becoming outdated.
TurretBot – Make each story arc a page separate from their associated events (e.g. [[User:TurretBot/SilvaGunner: Rebooted)]]
Mick — We do not need games by company (https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_video_games_by_company)
Mick — We do not need composer navboxes (https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Series_navboxes#Musicians) (except psy), replace with games by composer (https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/User:Mick_the_Squirrel/Media_by_composer)
Mick — Create a meme article and category for Nicolas Cage (https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/User:Mick_the_Squirrel/Rips_featuring_Nicolas_Cage)
very heavy on turret and mick's topics, probably wont get through all of them
  • 23:03: Pokemonfreak777: @TurretBot just checking again if youre joining
  • 23:05: TurretBot: hi
  • 23:05: TurretBot: oh do i have the floor
  • 23:05: Pokemonfreak777: yeah i suppose we can start. yes you have the floor now @TurretBot
  • 23:11: TurretBot: In its current state, the events navbox is cumbersome to navigate and does not work as a navbox for the following reasons:
- There are too many links on it.
- Events are listed chronologically instead of grouping related things together.
It is completely redundant with the page "List of channel events", the category for events, and the categories for events by season, which serve the same purpose of event navigation by listing the channel events chronologically, alphabetically, or alphabetically by season, respectively, and can already be found linked on every single channel event's page.
Additionally, having every single channel event's page link to every single other channel event clutters up the "Special:WhatLinksHere/" pages for all channel events, making it difficult to find pages that are actually linking to the event legitimately.
So my current belief is that the events navbox needs to be removed. It could potentially be split into smaller navboxes, either by season or based on certain types of commonly repeated events like Christmas, Halloween, April Fools, PSY Day etc. (where it would make sense to have a navbox due to the large "see also" sections on these events)
  • 23:11: TurretBot: There are other very large navboxes that share these flaws, but I just wanted to focus on this one for now.
  • 23:13: Ironwestie: I think this proposal makes a lot of good points. I don’t see a reason to have a bloated navbox with so many links. It’s like putting a copy of List of channel events everywhere it’s used
  • 23:14: Rickhenrique: I agreed that it would be better split into seasons, so it makes easier to find each event in stuff
  • 23:14: Mick the Squirrel: I like the splitting by season and holiday idea
  • 23:15: Spottygamester: I agree it should be split into separate navboxes as opposed to not having an events navbox at all.
  • 23:15: Arthur10123: I am also okay with scrapping it tbh, in favor of splitting it by seasons.
  • 23:15: Arthur10123: I think we can also have the navboxes for repeated holidays in addition to the split as well
  • 23:15: Airy342: i like the splitting into different seasons idea
  • 23:15: Pokemonfreak777: i personally dont think that we should remove the navbox outright since it does serve its purpose of event navigation (albeit poorly). i can get behind a split of the navbox by season though. dont know if we need to split by holiday though
  • 23:15: Pokemonfreak777: the navbox season split can also be incorporated into the season pages that we've already agreed to do
  • 23:16: Ironwestie: It sounds like we are split (haha) between splitting and removing the navbox
  • 23:16: Ironwestie: Perhaps we should discuss one option first
  • 23:17: Mick the Squirrel: in favor of splitting it implies being in favor of removing it
  • 23:17: TurretBot: Doesn't seem like a split
  • 23:18: Pokemonfreak777: i assume the new navboxes would be just take the place of the singular one currently at the bottom of the "list of channel events" page?
  • 23:18: TurretBot: Yes
  • 23:18: Mick the Squirrel: it'll still be a lot of links but it will be significantly less links
  • 23:19: Arthur10123: so basically just taking the individual season sections of the current navbox and turning them into their own navboxes
  • 23:20: TurretBot: yeah
  • 23:20: Arthur10123: cool
  • 23:21: Mick the Squirrel: and i assume all of them will be housed on the list of channel events page
  • 23:22: TurretBot: probably
  • 23:22: Minindo: Would there be links to the adjacent seasons at the top of the navbox like
Season 1 • Season 2 • Season 3
I know “links to the adjacent seasons” doesn’t make sense I am thinking 🤔 about turret’s idea for season pages, but for now those could just link to the first event of the seasons i guess
  • 23:22: Arthur10123: yes we should do that
  • 23:22: TurretBot: [in reply to: Pokemonfreak777: the navbox season split can also be incorporated into the season pages that we've already agreed to do] I did demo quite a long time ago at this point a navbox covering Season 2 in general, but I don't know if it's the best idea
  • 23:22: TurretBot: https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/User:TurretBot/Season_2?oldid=343553
  • 23:23: Rickhenrique: [in reply to: Minindo: Would there be links to the adjacent seasons at the top of the navbox like Season 1 • Season 2 • Season 3 I know “links to the adjacent seasons” doesn’t make sense I am t...] Would work best
  • 23:23: Pokemonfreak777: [in reply to: Minindo: Would there be links to the adjacent seasons at the top of the navbox like Season 1 • Season 2 • Season 3 I know “links to the adjacent seasons” doesn’t make sense I am t...] yeah i think that needs to be added. otherwise the navboxes will be sorta disconnected
  • 23:24: Minindo: I think it’s a pretty great idea to make season pages. I don’t know if we can incorporate it into the moot though as that probably constitutes its own proposal
  • 23:24: Pokemonfreak777: [in reply to: TurretBot: I did demo quite a long time ago at this point a navbox covering Season 2 in general, but I don't know if it's the best idea] might need to be redesigned a bit, but it is a good start
  • 23:24: Arthur10123: [in reply to: Minindo: I think it’s a pretty great idea to make season pages. I don’t know if we can incorporate it into the moot though as that probably constitutes its own proposal] we already agreed to do that but have only finished the Season 1 page so far
  • 23:24: Pokemonfreak777: [in reply to: Minindo: I think it’s a pretty great idea to make season pages. I don’t know if we can incorporate it into the moot though as that probably constitutes its own proposal] this was already approved in a prior moot. we just have not done much yet
  • 23:25: Minindo: Oh wow, didn’t know. I’ve been on vacation and i’ve been missing some moots
  • 23:25: Minindo: That’s great news
  • 23:25: Minindo: [in reply to: Minindo: Would there be links to the adjacent seasons at the top of the navbox like Season 1 • Season 2 • Season 3 I know “links to the adjacent seasons” doesn’t make sense I am t...] this should be done then, if the events navbox is split by seasons
  • 23:25: TurretBot: There are work in progress drafts for seasons 2 and 7
  • 23:26: Minindo: [in reply to: TurretBot: In its current state, the events navbox is cumbersome to navigate and does not work as a navbox for the following reasons: - There are too many links on it. - Events ar...] I’m now imagining navboxes for Christmas or Halloween itself…
  • 23:26: Rickhenrique: Theres the disambiguiation pages
  • 23:26: Mick the Squirrel: disambiguation doesnt look as cool
  • 23:26: Mick the Squirrel: and it isnt a navigation box its only one page
  • 23:27: Pokemonfreak777: anyways back to the main topic. any other opinions on the split before we vote?
ill use the following wording for the vote btw
We will split the current event navbox to new navboxes split by season.
  • 23:27: Pokemonfreak777: unless theres a better wording you want turret
  • 23:28: TurretBot: Should we try season in general or just events?
  • 23:28: Mick the Squirrel: i prefer season
  • 23:28: Rickhenrique: By seasons is better
  • 23:28: Mick the Squirrel: encapsulate all the ideas of the yearly period
  • 23:29: TurretBot: OK
  • 23:29: TurretBot: the wording works either way technically
  • 23:29: Mick the Squirrel: though it would be odd having links to meme pages from the channel events page
  • 23:29: Minindo: [in reply to: Mick the Squirrel: though it would be odd having links to meme pages from the channel events page] wdym by this
  • 23:29: Pokemonfreak777: also btw i think the split by holiday should be a separate vote/topic. dont know if you want to include it here
  • 23:30: Mick the Squirrel: [in reply to: Minindo: wdym by this] if all the links are going to be listed on the list of channel events, it's weird because memes aren't events
  • 23:30: Mick the Squirrel: the page should just be called "chronology of the channel" at that point
  • 23:30: Mick the Squirrel: offtopic?
  • 23:31: TurretBot: >History of SiIvaGunner
  • 23:31: Minindo: [in reply to: Mick the Squirrel: if all the links are going to be listed on the list of channel events, it's weird because memes aren't events] where are these meme links coming from, sorry if i’m forgetting something
  • 23:31: Mick the Squirrel: [in reply to: TurretBot: https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/User:TurretBot/Season_2?oldid=343553] this
  • 23:31: Mick the Squirrel: though it is a prototype
  • 23:31: Pokemonfreak777: ok i think we're getting off topic a bit
  • 23:31: Mick the Squirrel: ok
  • 23:32: TurretBot: [in reply to: Pokemonfreak777: also btw i think the split by holiday should be a separate vote/topic. dont know if you want to include it here] I was envisioning that people might think holiday navboxes made more sense than season ones. That seems to not be the case, so we can disregard that for this vote
  • 23:32: Pokemonfreak777: ok vote
We will split the current event navbox to new navboxes split by season.
8-0-0
  • 23:33: Pokemonfreak777: proposal has passed
  • 23:34: Minindo: That’s nice, a chunk of whatlinkshere for every event will be reduced 8x in size
  • 23:34: Arthur10123: I gotta tune out now tchau tchau
  • 23:34: Pokemonfreak777: turret you have the floor for your next topic
TurretBot – Add dev.fandom navbox to the wiki. All of the current navboxes (https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Navboxes) are converted at [https://test-123.fandom.com/wiki/category:navboxes.] A new version of Template:Navbox series (https://siivagunner.fandom.com/wiki/Template:Navbox_series) should not be created since it would be pointless; conversion of navbox series templates to dev.fandom navbox templates should be done on the main wiki to prevent series links from becoming outdated.
  • 23:34: TurretBot: This is a follow-up from the previous navbox overhaul moot
  • 23:34: TurretBot: We found that the dev.fandom navbox had issues, but overchad decided to just fix them globally for all of Fandom, so now there isn't really any reason to use the Wikipedia one.
  • 23:34: TurretBot: With this in mind, we should start moving things over to the actual wiki. LazyPeaster and I converted all of the navboxes that do not use Navbox series (which is programmatically independent from the main "Navbox" template on our wiki).
  • 23:37: Minindo: seems like a straightforward agreeable proposal, could you just briefly mention what the issues were, it was a bug about lists of certain length right
  • 23:37: TurretBot: To prevent possible importing of outdated link sets (i.e. a new game was ripped and it was not recorded on the test wiki), I think it would be best if the series-based navboxes are chipped away at on the actual wiki instead of on the test wiki, by moving them from "Navbox series" to the dev.fandom Navbox after it is imported.
  • 23:37: TurretBot: [in reply to: Minindo: seems like a straightforward agreeable proposal, could you just briefly mention what the issues were, it was a bug about lists of certain length right] The alternating background colors did not function properly with child navboxes on the dev.fandom navbox before overcast fixed it.
  • 23:39: TurretBot: [in reply to: TurretBot: To prevent possible importing of outdated link sets (i.e. a new game was ripped and it was not recorded on the test wiki), I think it would be best if the series-based navb...] The dev.fandom navbox is very straightforward to use, so Navbox series (which was introduced to make it easy to build nicer-looking navboxes) becomes a moot point in my eyes.
  • 23:40: Pokemonfreak777: looking over a few of the navboxes they look alright. im okay with starting the proposed conversion
  • 23:40: TurretBot: Basically meaning "Navbox series" and the dev.fanfom navbox will coexist for some time
  • 23:40: TurretBot: Navbox series doesn't have any dependencies so it should be fine.
  • 23:41: Mick the Squirrel: are we removing the "Navbox series" bit of the page title too?
  • 23:41: TurretBot: That should be done but I think it can be discussed in a later moot
  • 23:41: TurretBot: Ideally it would be a bot action
  • 23:42: Mick the Squirrel: yeah
thought it would be a small enough point to lump in here but alright
  • 23:42: TurretBot: well we probably want to do it all at once and it probably makes more sense to do after the conversion rather than before
  • 23:43: Pokemonfreak777: any other opinions or are we good to vote?
  • 23:44: TurretBot: [in reply to: Pokemonfreak777: any other opinions or are we good to vote?] Ok, can we vote with:
We will import the dev.fandom Navbox and replace the current templates using our outdated Template:Navbox with ones created for the dev.fandom Navbox on the test-123 wiki
We will convert the series navboxes to use the dev.fandom Navboxes over time.
After there are no more navboxes using Navbox series, we will remove "Navbox series" from the template names.
We will import the dev.fandom Navbox and replace the current templates using our outdated Template:Navbox with ones created for the dev.fandom Navbox on the test-123 wiki
We will convert the series navboxes to use the dev.fandom Navboxes over time.
After there are no more navboxes using Navbox series, we will remove "Navbox series" from the template names.
====
vote end
  • 23:47: Pokemonfreak777: 5-0-0
  • 23:47: Pokemonfreak777: proposal passed
  • 23:47: TurretBot: Thanks Overcast :salute:
  • 23:47: Pokemonfreak777: alright i believe you have one more topic turret
  • 23:47: TurretBot: ok
  • 23:47: TurretBot: currently, the only pages we have on siivagunner story arcs are The SilvaGunner Christmas Comeback Crisis and Mashup Crusaders Arc
  • 23:47: TurretBot: this is despite that there have been a few more

Pokemonfreak777 pinned a message to this channel. See all pinned messages. — 07/06/2024 23:48

  • 23:48: TurretBot: however, information regarding them has usually been only covered with their associated channel events
  • 23:48: TurretBot: This includes:
- SilvaGunner: Rebooted
- A Murder Not Too Nice
- Curse of the Fallen Angel
- The Cult of Proto
We will make story arcs into separate pages from their associated events.
====
vote end
- The page isn’t an efficient method of sorting games. Series Navboxes work and are necessary because games reuse music / composers and characters. The company just distributes them.
- We aren’t (really) meant to be a website dedicated to tracking video game trivia. This feels more like a subpage project. If one wants to know who distributed these games simply go to wikipedia
- At most only a handful of companies have relevance to the channel (Bethesda, Valve, Sony - chad warden i guess). Use List of rips referencing companies to find direct references to them.
  • 0:03: Mick the Squirrel: that is all
  • 0:04: TurretBot: I agree with this
  • 0:05: Rickhenrique: I mean
  • 0:05: Rickhenrique: Fair choice enough honestly
  • 0:05: Rickhenrique: Plus it feels more that would fit in as a section for games that wasnt ripped too
  • 0:05: Rickhenrique: Or just use it as an navbox
  • 0:05: Rickhenrique: Either way or another, yeah it should be removed
  • 0:05: Rickhenrique: Nothing against it
  • 0:06: TurretBot: it might make sense to have more sorting for the list of unripped games with references than just alphabetical
  • 0:06: TurretBot: although that's a bit off topic
  • 0:07: Pokemonfreak777: This was a holdover / compromise from several moots discussing the topic. i briefly went through the prior discussions and the general consensus seemed to be that having them was probably unnecessary but some people really wanted it to exist in some form
  • 0:07: TechnCheese: of course I get here as the moot is ending
  • 0:07: Mick the Squirrel: [in reply to: Pokemonfreak777: This was a holdover / compromise from several moots discussing the topic. i briefly went through the prior discussions and the general consensus seemed to be...] it can still be a subpage project, it just doesn't seem necessary for the main wiki
  • 0:07: Mick the Squirrel: i meant to run my proposal by notcreepypasta first to ask if they had any input but i wrote this in like 5 minutes during the moot
  • 0:09: TurretBot: I don't like the way that it's just formatted like a bunch of navboxes without formatting. (i.e. spinoffs being a separate section, instead of like, a sub-bullet or something)
  • 0:09: Minindo: I think most information about games on this wiki is useful even if maybe it’s “extraneous”… except for this list which does seem pretty pointless
  • 0:11: Mick the Squirrel: please don't delete this page immediately too, i want to give them time to save it
  • 0:11: Mick the Squirrel: even if it isnt necessary, hard work was put into this
  • 0:11: Pokemonfreak777: yeah i honestly dont care either way about keeping the page (even though i made the initial design). we can remove the page and move its contents to a userpage (probably mine)
  • 0:11: TurretBot: to be fair I don't think the list of playlists is a good way to sort games either (after being split)
  • 0:12: Rickhenrique: Definivelly
  • 0:12: Minindo: list of playlists is still extremely useful
  • 0:12: TurretBot: so there could be a discussion about that, and maybe a page like this could work but i don't like the way it's set up
  • 0:12: Pokemonfreak777: [in reply to: Pokemonfreak777: yeah i honestly dont care either way about keeping the page (even though i made the initial design). we can remove the page and move its contents to a userpag...] as a matter of fact, we can probably include the moving as part of the vote, if thats okay with you mick
  • 0:12: Mick the Squirrel: yeah
  • 0:12: Mick the Squirrel: ok any other points?
  • 0:13: Rickhenrique: [in reply to: Minindo: list of playlists is still extremely useful] True
  • 0:13: Mick the Squirrel: [in reply to: Minindo: list of playlists is still extremely useful] splitting it messes with the rip count
  • 0:14: TurretBot: [in reply to: Minindo: list of playlists is still extremely useful] i feel like a lot of its value was lost by not being able to see the most-ripped games
if you just want them alphabetically it's already Category:Playlists :Shrug:
  • 0:14: TurretBot: on the plus side we did get garten of ban ban gay version... if you want to call that a plus side
  • 0:15: Pokemonfreak777: [in reply to: Pokemonfreak777: as a matter of fact, we can probably include the moving as part of the vote, if thats okay with you mick]
We will move "List of video games by company" to Pokemonfreak777's user page, effectively removing it from the main wiki namespace
does this wording work for the vote?
  • 0:15: Mick the Squirrel: 👍
  • 0:15: Minindo: [in reply to: TurretBot: i feel like a lot of its value was lost by not being able to see the most-ripped games if you just want them alphabetically it's already Category:Playlists :Shrug:] I don’t like that it was split either even though i understand it, but it’s still useful for reading even when nerfed
  • 0:15: Pokemonfreak777: alright if there are no other opinions ill begin the vote soon
  • 0:15: TurretBot: i actually have a proposal related to this, so we can come back to this in a later moot
  • 0:16: Pokemonfreak777: vote
We will move "List of video games by company" to Pokemonfreak777's user page, effectively removing it from the main wiki namespace
====
vote end
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